How to talk about money with your kids with Kori Olsen

Matt: Welcome to Bellingham Technical College’s Money$marts Podcast. I’m your host, Matt Benoit. Each episode we’ll talk with BTC students, staff, community professionals and financial literacy and wellness all to help listeners navigate resources in the community and empower themselves financially. Today we’re here with Kori Olsen! We had you on a previous episode of this podcast, it was actually about childcare but will you remind listeners of what you do at BTC?
Kori: Sure! I work at the WorkForce Funding department here at Bellingham Technical College and what that is – it’s a series of grant funded programs that help students with support with their tuition, tools, books, childcare, transportation. Anything beyond traditional financial aid.
Matt: So, in other words, you spend quite a bit of time talking with BTC students about funding?
Kori: Yes!
Matt: First of all, what are some strategies you use within your position to help students feel comfortable approaching you with questions about their funding?
Kori: Well, first and foremost, I think it’s really important when students come in to help them feel comfortable. Sometimes looking for funding opportunities, honestly it can be confusing because there’s a lot of language that goes around it. So, what we try to do is be really universal in how we speak to students to take out, you know, the acronyms and the fluff language. But also, to just realize that that could be a stressful time for students. Often, with WorkForce Funding programs you do have to meet certain eligibility criteria, so that may mean we have to look at your income or you’ve gone through unemployment processes or you’re going through some significant life transitions. So really, myself and my fellow coordinators, what we try to do is just sit down, make people feel comfortable about talking about money and about talking about these funding resources and making sure they’re clear on their participation in these various programs. 
Matt: Part of the goal of this podcast is to get folks comfortable with talking about money. So, when we’re seeking assistance with our finances, we’re putting ourselves in somewhat of a vulnerable position because money can be such a taboo topic in our society so. But why do you think money is such a taboo topic?
Kori: You know, I think money is a taboo topic because it’s so pervasive to all aspects of our lives. And it’s a very personal topic. If you think about it, money crosses several lines, generational lines, cultural lines, there’s power dynamics that come with have or have not, the political spectrum. So, I think it becomes someone’s personal story. And with all of that wrapped up in there, that does become a very personal topic. Right? Just one of those topics alone would be personal let alone having money attached to it. For me, I had a situation where I was making very good money back in 2008. I was a real estate agent and 2008 that market was booming, a lot of people were in that business. Overnight, the bubble burst. I had a four bedroom house that went into foreclosure. And from a Tuesday to a Wednesday I went from that house to a one bedroom – room at my parent’s house with my toddler. So that story, I’m willing to share that story, but that became very personal to me and people all the time are riding those tides. If you think about it, you purchase your first home – that’s a very exciting thing. Guess what that’s attached to? That’s attached to your finances. Or if you lose a job. Guess what that’s attached to? That’s attached to your finances. So I think it just, it just really envelopes every aspect of our life so it makes it difficult sometimes to communicate about those things.
Matt: In your position, sharing a lot of things with students, helping them… Do you share your personal anecdotes with students? Was it difficult for you to get to a point where you felt comfortable doing that? 
Kori: Yes, it definitely was a process for me. I mean, of course when you go through a major situation like that, your first thing is sort of that survival mode of just trying to put things back together. But I feel so connected to the students that I work with here because I went through very similar systems and some grant funding possibilities that they did to get where they’re going. So, I feel like I understand the road map. When I moved, I actually had to move back to my parents’ house to Bellingham, here. I was able to get TANF, which is money that you can get through DSHS to help you rebuild. I was able to get assistance with my childcare so that I could get onto my next position. And ironically enough, I figured, well real estate is bust so I need to go where the jobs are in demand. And in 2008, the jobs were in demand at the unemployment office. So, I ended up getting a job at the unemployment office where I learned about all these opportunities. It is absolutely my passion to help people that have experience something so similar to what I’ve been through. So, yes, that’s helped me open up quite a bit. I’m very willing to share my story because I don’t think it’s an isolated story. I think a lot of people have some refinements of it and the more that we’re able to talk about it, the more – or I’d say the less we feel isolated in that situation. 
Matt: So you mentioned TANF, what exactly does that stand for?
Kori: Oh, that is Temporary Assistance for Needy Families.
Matt: Okay, so, when we talk about this discomfort with talking about money, do you think this could start at a young age?
Kori: Absolutely, I think back about my childhood, we never really talked a lot about money. I think the one story that I remember is that we always saved our change. My dad had a huge glass jar and he said if we saved our change that he would take us to Disneyland. I got to go when I was 30. [Laughs] So, that was, that was the point of understanding money in my family and for me it was just sort of a watch and learn process. We didn’t have a lot of communication around that. And I think because some of these cultural things, these generational things are just, again money is such a personal topic that it’s not always taught at home. So, I don’t necessarily think that kids are getting that full education at a young age.
Matt: So, in a previous episode we discussed who’s responsible for teaching the public, including young people about money. So, what’s your opinion on that? Should it be parents, teachers, media, family members, some combination thereof? 
Kori: I would say some combination thereof. I would say, honestly, the parents or whoever is your mentor within your family should be having those conversations. It’s not just about the conversations though, they watch what you do. My eldest just recently told me, she said, “I notice that you tend to spend your money. You like something you go and get it! And, Dad, he hardly ever spends money and he researches it and then he buys what is the best product.” So, just knowing that your kids are watching and engaging them in that conversation. But now, there’s programs such as Junior Achievement that are going out into the schools. So having that layer in there too. Having some aspect of being able to balance a budget, you know, within the, even the middle school curriculum is absolutely necessary.
Matt: So, back to your personal life, how do you teach your own children about money? And actually, first of all, how many children do you have and how old are they?
Kori: So, I have two girls, one is six and one is twelve. And I have multiple mediums in which I try to teach them about money and I will tell you, not everything sticks. It’s kind of by trial and error. The first thing that I would say that I’ve always done from a young age with both of them is I’ve had them pay for their items at the grocery store. So, I may be supplying the money but they have that exchange with the cashier because I want that to be something that becomes comfortable for them. Other things that I’ve done is I created some fun games. I created a game that’s kind of a pizza board and you can take your toppings and put them on different categories like, let’s say you’re saving for your education or your retirement or your food. You get to put those topics anywhere on the board to begin with but then as you go through the game there’s pitfalls there. So, let’s say you forgot to put money on insurance, then suddenly, there’s a roof fire or something. So then you start to lose toppings. And that was effective for my six year old because my six year old when we first started playing the game wanted to put all the toppings on food. Because what’s important to a six year old? Food! By the end of it, she was mad that I didn’t save for her education. So that stuck. I had one trial and error where I decided to try to teach my kids that, you know, if  you put your change in a jar and you burry it, a money tree is going to grow. I told them it was magic. And my twelve-year-old said “that’s Pinterest…” [Laugh] That wasn’t going to work for her. But I did it with the six year old and it was great, we filled it up with change, the tree grew, suddenly there was a money tree outside, and I thought I had it spot on. Until the next day she ran out there and wanted to see why there wasn’t more dollar bills on that tree. So it is a multi-layered approach but for me, it is really about building in the accountability. I want them to understand wants and needs, so if they, if they get money to go out and buy a toy, we come home and we donate two that are now old. So it’s just kind of about that, if you want something you need to be willing to do the give and take.
Matt: So, obviously, they are learning quite a bit from you. Are they also, I know they’re a little bit younger. When I was in high school I took, and this was an elective, I could take a personal finance class, which I did. I had found that relatively helpful, but an elective is not required obviously. So, at a young age, the ages that they are, are they getting information from school?
Kori: Actually, I was really impressed. My six year old has not had that yet but my twelve-year-old is in middle school. And came home and was really into this project that she had with other friends. Her teacher assigned them to decide, “What do you want to do as a career?” “How much money does that career make on average?” “What type of education would you need for that?” “What would your education cost you?” “If you wanted to move into a house with that, you know, particular occupation, how much would that cost you?” What’s the cost of living? So now she wants to be an orthopedic surgeon. She’ll probably change her mind throughout the year but she really did have to go through all of those steps to make these solid decisions and it was the first time, I’d seen her super interested in a career path. So she got that from school by doing sort of the financial part of that.
Matt: Do you feel like even at a relatively young age - with that sort of, having your child be exposed to that kind of information… I mean, I think when you’re younger, and you’re not an adult, you’re not doing those things, it all seems very foreign. Do you feel like that is… that makes everything slightly more tangible and more understandable to her?
Kori: To my twelve-year-old that had the…
Matt: Yeah.
Kori: Yes. I think she’s thinking along those lines now. I mean, if you think about it, wow she only has six years before she graduates. So, having that... I wish I had that growing up because I might have made different decisions about what educational choice I chose. Or what career track I chose. That’s one of the reasons I love Bellingham Technical College is because we have so much in technical and trade that lead to these high wage positions. So, yes, I think that that did plant a seed for her and that that’s something that should continue to grow at home too.
Matt: So, why do you think it’s so important to talk about money at such a young age? I mean, your six year old for instance, that’s quite young.
Kori: I think that, given the experience that I had or that I’ve had throughout the years with money, I just want, I want my girls to be able to be independent. And I want them to be able to save for surprises and emergencies. And I also want them to feel really confident in being able to talk about those things that sometimes seem like a taboo topic. So, that they can just get better information and be better informed to have safe and solid lives.
Matt: Yeah, and if you lay that foundation for financial wellness and understanding early in life, they’re probably going to, as they encounter various financial challenges, and various financial goals, they’re probably going to feel that much more confident and in control about it.
Kori: Yup! And self-sufficient!  
Matt: Exactly. So, do you know of any resources for parents and their children that can help teach about money?
Kori: Yes, I do. There’s a really good website. It’s run by Washington State. It’s actually Washington State Department of Financial Institutions, kind of a mouth full, but there is – I’ll give you the website address. But if you go on there, there is savvy money saving videos for kids and they’re very kid friendly, they have cartoon characters. It’s a great way to start setting the stage for those conversations. That website address is www.dfi.wa.gov.
Matt: So, is there anything else you’d like to add about the subject of teaching young people about money or do you think we’ve touched all the bases?
Kori: No, I think we’ve touched all the bases. I would just say for parents that are worried about, I don’t know, engaging in those conversations: go for it! Kids are really receptive and there are ways of talking about money and financing and all these things that sound big and scary that can be made fun. So, I would just say, be open to those conversations.
Matt: Excellent! Well, Kori thank you so much for being on the show today!
Kori: Thank you!
Matt: Thanks for listening to this episode of the BTC Money$marts podcast be sure to check out all our episodes on the BTC website. They’re loaded with stories, tips, and tricks and strategies for financial literacy. This podcast is produced by Cheryl Kennedy with music courtesy of Bensounds.com. I’m Matt Benoit, we’ll see you next time.